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Tuesday, June 23, 2009

I just got off the phone with a friend, a highly intelligent and principled person I've known since college, who's been living overseas for several years.

She is shocked to learn that Ahmadijenad might not be a nice anti-imperialist populist, as he is seen by many around the world.

I asked her how on earth anybody could have formed that opinion of him.

She replied, "People overseas see America as such a bully that anybody standing in opposition to us is highly regarded."

If this is true it explains much about the hate fest at Durban as well as reflecting real hatred of America. If Ahmadijenad is good then Israel must be the very devil, America an even greater one.

It scares me to think how many billions of people might perceive the world this way. It scares me even more given the outrageous antisemitism that is common even in places where there are no Jews.

Maybe the images streaming out of Iran, and the ominous warnings from the regime, will open some minds?

11 Comments

Maybe the images streaming out of Iran, and the ominous warnings from the regime, will open some minds?

Of course they will. The Zionists are behind it!

She replied, "People overseas see America as such a bully that anybody standing in opposition to us is highly regarded."

And that perception is thanks to the Wire Services and supported by the MSM that misinforms and deceives, and people blinded by their own preconceived ideas.
If this person has not been able to analyse what has happened to Iran these past 30 years then of course they will go along with its killing of Jews in the community centre in Buenos Aires Argentina which had nothing to do with Israel but was just a soft target, the mad war against Iraq which killed a couple of million bi-pedal animals, the hegemonic behaviour in Lebanon with the monster Hezbollah that they created, etc.
In similar fashion a lot of these highly intelligent people cannot see how Arafat and co ripped off the Palestinians, and previously mired Lebanon in a civil war slaughtering countless Christians there after attempting a Putsch in Jordan (Black September).

Funny how the people overseas don't see all the money the US pumped into rebuilding Europe, Japan and other places into vibrant places of relative peace and prosperity.

Durban was another disgrace that the MSM went along with instead of showing the disgraceful machinations of the UN's Arab block in their attempt to bring back hatred of the Jews into respectability.
Thanks to that and wishy-washy US behaviour in the UN anti-Semitism is now practically mainstream.

It scares me even more given the outrageous antisemitism that is common even in places where there are no Jews.

Antisemitism is easier in places where there are no Jews. It's difficult to hold on to a very negative stereotype when your next-door neighbor violates that stereotype routinely.

It's also easy to be misled about Ahmadinejad, if you don't see any of the issues surrounding him as affecting you. If you're ambivalent about his Holocaust-denying and threats against Israel to finish the job, it's a small step to believe what HE says about himself -- that he was elected fairly, that his Iran does not abuse human rights for women or homosexuals, and so on.

Ahmadinejad can be a very persuasive man. Dictators usually are; they need to be. And there are always droves of people willing to give the benefit of the doubt to them -- not realizing that they are putting their trust in habitual liars.

Perhaps one way to address this, with a genuinely intelligent (but deluded) person, is to ask theoretically -- can you imagine a person who would lie any time they can get away with it, so long as it furthers their own personal agenda? Can you imagine such a person lying about their own misdeeds, even crimes, by making everyone around them doubt the existence of what they can see with their own eyes?

If they can't, I'd think it's up to them to disprove that such people can exist. And if they do believe such people can exist, well, the question then becomes -- what if one of them becomes a national leader? If such a person is adept in saying all the things a caring leader is expected to say, what danger signs should we look for?

...or we could simply cut to the chase, and explain that politicians and rulers should ALWAYS be presumed to be liars and scoundrels, unless we have good evidence that they are not. (Why? Because if we don't, and they persuade us with their lies long enough to get elected, we're in big trouble indeed.)

respectfully,
Daniel in Brookline

You know what else - some of the states who claim America is a bully simultaneously and routinely abuse their own people.

It's ironic isn't it, that some of America's worst critics live in or lead states or regions where government is anything but "of the people, for the people," where women are oppressed or even mutilated, gays are killed or "don't exist"; where hundreds of thousands of people are killed and dispossessed - there are horrendous ongoing civil wars, even genocides - and poverty and disease are rampant.

My friend was living in such a region. She is reflecting what she absorbed from the people there, although she may have been predisposed to adopt their beliefs.

Many of the so-called "elders" come from Africa, and seem to be focusing their sentiments toward America on Israel.

Of course Jimmy Carter is an "Elder" too so go figure. Anyway it does seem that hatred of the US overlaps with antisemitism, and all the problems and suffering in the Third World are somehow laid at the feet of Israel if one is to believe the Durban conferences and the UN "human rights" commissions.

Logically this makes zero sense. One could make arguments against "colonialism/imperialism" and Cold War proxy battles and the wholesale arming of Africa for example, and the ongoing effects thereof; but focusing all that on Israel is just absurd.

And, considering that the Yishuv was blockaded and essentially left to die by the British Empire, and also was a victim of the Cold War, it's astonishing that "anti-racism" conferences and the "unaligned" nations in the US would focus on the one small state whose people have been serially abused and lost at least 1/3 of their total global population within living memory - as a result of racism.

Another aspect of this - Jews are actually accused of trying to spread AIDs and other diseases in vaccines - other crazy stuff - probably this applies to other people who are trying to help eradicate disease. This creates a double whammy: it increases bigotry and fear along with poverty and disease.

I hadn't realized until I talked to my friend how ignorant I've been of these other points of view, or how prevalent they are around the world including, probably, in the West.

I think this is exacerbated by the fact that MSM is on a very fast news cycle, as President Obama pointed out, that much of it is biased, but also that people are not interested in learning history but only focus on what (they think) is happening RIGHT NOW. Look at the enduring power of the al Durah film or the myth of Jenin, and the confusion about Sabra and Shatilla, which continues to be blamed on Israel.

These factors in combination with a press that may be reflecting various agendas, isn't really independent and isn't always accurate, has apparently created a toxic situation.

Does anybody know what to do about it?

Via Israel Matzav, from within Iran, an eyewitness video

"... to express our opposition to these killings ... and demanding freedom"

"... but the black clad police, they stop everyone ... some five-hundred ... with clubs ... came out of [a mosque] and ... started beating everyone and they tried to beat everyone on [a pedestrian bridge], throwing them off of the bridge ..."

"... they beat a woman so savagely she was drenched in blood, her husband who was watching the scene he just fainted"

"... the security forces shooting young people"

"... they were trying to beat people so that they would die"

"... they were beating old men ... this was a ... massacre"

"... people were being shot like animals, they beat the people like animals"

"... they are killing students with axes ... they put the ax to the heart of young men"

"...it's so devastating, this is horrific ... this is a massacre ... this is [like] Hitler"

You make some good points, Sophia.

Israel has long had the policy -- consistent with ancient Jewish teachings -- of trying to make the world around it a better place. Israel's tremendous record of R&D, of innovation in technology and medicine and agriculture, is testament to this. The world is a far better place today because it has an Israel in it.

But Israel has long been castigated and despised for the very help it gives to others, even to its enemies. As you point out, Israel develops life-saving vaccines -- and is accused of using them to spread AIDS among Arabs. Israel treats Palestinians in its world-class hospitals -- and those hospitals become targets of suicide bombers as a result. Not long ago, during a blockage of Gaza I believe, Gazan hospitals announced that they were short of whole blood -- so Israel lifted the blockade long enough to bring in large quantities of blood from its own blood banks. Unbelievably, the Palestinians turned it down, claiming that they didn't want Jewish blood. Even more unbelievably, Israel -- which would have been perfectly justified in dropping the matter -- arranged for a shipment of whole blood from Jordan instead.

And today we see that, just as Jews are the canary in the coal mine for the countries in which they live, so too is Israel's treatment by the world a foreshadowing of what other Western democracies can expect. America, too, is castigated for trying to help, in Iraq and Afghanistan and elsewhere; the Marshall Plan and the Berlin Airlift have been forgotten, as has American assistance during the Christmas Tsunami of a few years ago.

Does anybody know what to do about it?

As the old joke says, in the Middle East actions don't always have reasons, and problems don't have to have solutions. I do think, however, that in our desire to be helpful to victims of tyranny, we have forgotten how to treat tyrants.

Americans and Israelis truly are partners now, fighting the same fight. I think an important first step is to recognize this.

respectfully,
Daniel in Brookline

Sorry, the story about blood deliveries was in Jenin in 2002, not Gaza:

http://www.snopes.com/inboxer/outrage/blood.asp

It seems to me like Sophia just excused anti Americanism.

Shame on you.

The Soviets armed Africa and everywhere else they could push revolution.

Those damn reacitonary imperialists the Americans armed the resistance....and shed blood with them, although more often than not the US and Western Left gave aid and comfort to the enemy of liberty and democracy.

Hey, like they are still doing. Go figure. The more things change, the more they stay the same.

The Western Left is a foul force on the planet.

Hi Daniel,

I think one of the more upsetting aspects of "realism" is the apparent willingness to "engage" with tyrants should "interests" appear to be served.

Nobody is real clear as to whose or which interests of course.

However, it is doubtful to me that "America's interests" are best served by violating our core values.

That's not necessarily true if we think our interests are strictly those of certain industries and/or leveraging maximum power against the rest of the world.

In those cases we are supposed to shut our eyes and Think of England, so to speak?

Is that all we are - brute force and purchasing power? I don't think so - I think the "realists" are highly unrealistic or at least unimaginative about what drives people, what keeps some nations fresh and creative and ruins others...values do count, don't they?

What about the ability to "see", to envision alternative solutions or possibilities that don't violate core values? If we listen to the "realists" we don't have values, that's all just window dressing and we're a big hungry animal is all - I refuse to believe that's all we are, all we are capable of.

Oh c'mon EV.

Nobody is "excusing anti-Americanism". As President Obama said, we've been a tremendous source of progress in the world. We've also been blamed for things we didn't do and scapegoated for problems other nations cannot or will not confront. Of course this is also true of Israel and the West in general.

However, we have done things that were cruel and wrong as well. In the service of certain industries and powerful individuals we have undermined popular movements and engineered coups and counter-revolutions - this has been obvious and damaging in our own hemisphere. Our relations with Latin America are terrible and we bear some responsibility for this. Arming the mujeheddin in Afghanistan, then neglecting the infrastructure and educational facilities in that ruined country, has come back around to bite us in the tuchas.

However, there's no reason we can't work from this point forward to try and mend fences and strengthen the Americas and other vital regions from within.

As far as Africa is concerned, the Middle East also, no doubt the Soviets were arming and inciting some of the worst factions in the area.

However, we have made our share of mistakes. We were initially supporters of Idi Amin, for one - that counts as a mistake of historic proportions. We armed and supported Saddam Hussein.

Look. The world has changed tremendously just since the Industrial Revolution. Everybody has been affected. It is hard to catch your breath. People have gone from one world to another almost overnight. We couldn't even fly before 1903. The 20th century saw two horrible global wars, the invention of nuclear power, the collapse of empires and great revolutions, the destruction and creation of nations, travel to the moon.

People being the imperfect creatures that we are, even with the best intentions we make mistakes - especially in times of unprecedented upheaval and change.

There is no crime in acknowledging errors and misjudgements. The real crime would be denying them, refusing to accept responsbility when we've been wrong, and learning from our mistakes.

And, we need to be careful as to how we do business, how we interact not only in the US but abroad, and we need to pay a lot more attention to the planet itself and try to figure out not only dollar costs but human and other environmental costs.

By "we" incidentally I mean all of us, all the people on the planet. Each of us affects everybody else.

As an example, the Chinese habit of eating shark fins is threatening the pelagic sharks, many irreplaceable species are facing extinction. This is bound to have an adverse effect on the oceans as a whole - already overfishing and pollution have taken a serious toll.

We have got to get a grip. Our actions affect each other. The whole world is organically linked.

The Chinese say, in March a butterfly flaps his wings in Beijing; by August a hurricane forms in the Caribbean. People studying real weather patterns note similar examples of cause and effect. So this isn't just philosophy; it is fact.

Awareness isn't anti-American, seeing the connectness of people and events isn't anti-American; and nor is learning from past mistakes and working hard to create new ideas, new solutions.

In fact progress and creativity are part of our core, are they not?

If you want to be really anti-American, stick your head in the sand.

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